How to Maintain Friendships as an Adult

Show notes

Friendship Through Time: How to Maintain Friendships as an Adult

How do you maintain friendships as an adult, when work, family and moves keep pulling you away? Randy Lorensen, Dr. John Oberg and Anthony Marino talk about why friendships fade and what it takes to keep them.

Friend groups often fade not because anything went wrong, but because both people have other priorities. The hosts talk about networks they've stopped investing in, why someone has to be the instigator (and why it can be you), and why maintaining relationships really is a job. As they put it: show me your checkbook and your calendar.

They talk about couples who disappear into a cocoon, the season of life you're in, and why small gestures are enough. There's a story about a friend who makes everyone feel awesome and a phone call after Hurricane Harvey, plus Gary Chapman's five love languages.

They close with career moves across cities, what happens when the person who held a family together is gone, and a simple plan for reaching out to people who've drifted away: set aside the time.

How Friendships Change With Age, and How to Keep Them

What you'll discover:

Why friendships fade even when nothing went wrong
Being the instigator: anyone can do it
"Show me your checkbook and your calendar"
Small gestures, and the five love languages in friendship
Moving cities and keeping friendships across distance
A simple way to reconnect with people who've drifted away

Timestamps

[00:00] Why friend groups fade: it's a Venn diagram
[00:52] The networks you're not investing in
[01:41] Someone has to be the instigator
[03:18] Anyone can be the instigator
[04:05] Maintaining relationships is a job
[05:44] "Show me your checkbook and your calendar"
[06:34] Balance, and couples in a cocoon
[08:13] The season of life you're in
[09:49] Small gestures are enough
[10:37] The friend who makes everyone feel awesome, and a call after Hurricane Harvey
[13:51] Gary Chapman's five love languages
[16:15] Your spouse and your fast five
[17:04] Career moves, new cities and friendships left behind
[19:28] When the family's connector is gone
[20:16] Advice for younger listeners
[21:04] Reaching out to people who drifted away: set the time aside
[24:19] Attachment and acceptance
[25:58] Wrap-up, and a preview of the next part

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About the hosts

This is a hosts-only episode with no guest: Randy Lorensen, Dr. John Oberg and Anthony Marino. (Host bios are on the host pages linked below.)

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Related episodes

Meet the hosts: Randy Lorensen · Dr. John Oberg · Anthony Marino

Transcript

A transcript of the published podcast audio is below (it starts 27:25 into the YouTube video; the time markers follow the podcast audio). It was generated automatically from the episode audio, so expect some spelling errors in names and terms.

[00:00] it but it it naturally ran its course for for whatever the reason. I think it's I'm supposing here. I don't know the answer definitively, but I think it's like it's like a ven diagram, right? If both people don't have the time to invest, it's not about it being a bad relationship. It's just other things are higher priority. You know, like for me right now, I've got two adult kids out of the house, one in the house, and so I'm very focused on a number of things there, right? Like getting all the time I can with the last one in the house, and then making sure that all three of them, who are all three in different cities, try to stay connected to us and to each other. And so I'm really like there's there's energy that goes into that. And so, um, that's that is a part of the season that I'm in right now. And so that means naturally that there's, you know, less energy to invest in lots of other places. And even this week, I was thinking about all the networks that I have access to right now that I'm not investing in. And like I need to evaluate that like are there some personal and professional networks that I could or should be investing in. But I I think that just I mean once every six months or so I really try to think through that and really put some time and some headsp space into that. And um yeah. So, John, you said earlier, I don't remember the verbiage, but there was a you talked about there was a facilitator, an instigator, an organizer. And I'm thinking what Anthony said with that group. My guess, Anthony, is that one of those 12 people was that organizer, that facilitator? Could be.

[01:34] It could be as simple as did that person, did something happen? Did they get busy? Did did they lose it? I mean I mean it really might be as simple as it is that one person wasn't leading it forward. Well, and I've been in the instigator in a lot of groups and sometimes if if it's like if the flywheel doesn't catch, you know, it's like that's, you know, and it's not a it's not a like conscious decision to stop doing it. But but I think I think that's a really important I've never thought about this, right? is cuz as we're doing this, I'm running through my mind and I'm I'm thinking of people that I really liked and we had a good relationship and just separated and and again, sometimes I moved and sometime, you know, I'm thinking of people in different phases of my life that I probably should be closer with. Well, I I met somebody who I really liked in a in a setting that was uh not professional, was personal. We spent some time together for for a long weekend with our families and then we like we need to do this more. We tried to get lunch, but every time we tried to get a dinner or a thing, it was always, "Wait, wait, wait, wait, no, wait, wait, wait, wait, no, wait, wait, wait, wait, no." And after five of those, I'm like, "Okay." Whether it's an intended message or not, I accept.

[02:46] Right. Right. No matter how great that first thing was, like I'm happy to keep trying, but to the point where you're not Yeah. not available. It's not even not willing. It may just not be not able that that like that just that's okay. Yeah. I I'm just thinking in my case there wasn't an instigator and I think a lot of the things that have stayed together is because the other person has been better at being the instigator than me and some of these that just I've never had a strategy. I've never thought about it. I've never I guess I haven't invested. You're allowed to be the instigator by the way. Like anybody can do it. It doesn't take like a certain type of anything. Like literally anybody can be an instigator. I think about you know the group the three of us are in. like I'm the instigator for that, but there's a whole lot of things that happen outside of our things that I'm structuring for the group in a very facilitated way that you guys have instigated and frankly I'm not even included in not because you haven't tried to include me but well fine with that too that but that's really healthy, right? Yeah. That it's a really healthy thing to not try to control all of it.

[03:52] Yeah. And so I very deliberately don't control that. See, I'm in control there. Sorry. I think what crystallizing for me in this discussion I hope the listeners are getting the same feeling is that th this is a um a a a a job in a sense you know to maintain if you if it's important to you maintaining relationships and cultivating um those friendships is a job it takes time and I you know I I'm in a later season than you guys uh and a lot of the listeners But I I kind of liken it to a road trip where you you draw you drove for 15 20 minutes and you don't really remember anything. You're just at this destination and a lot of that I have a lot of that sense about you know the relationships in the past. Suddenly you you become conscious and you say wow I I haven't uh engaged in that group um in you know some period of time or I haven't talked to that person in some period of time. So it's a job and unfortunately you have priorities in your life that are that in some cases with kids is you have responsibilities to someone's life and liberty. So you put that first and a lot of times that can just eat up all your time and you've got no energy, no time, no conviction to do anything else but take care of that.

[05:26] So we have most people find they have space if they want to make space for something. Like that's the thing that like for me I just have to be honest about the fact that I've got space for the things that I want to make space for. And one of my favorite and most painful moments was when I talked to one of my mentors and I wanted to talk about my priorities, my goals. And he said, 'I I don't need to you to tell me any of those things. Show me your checkbook in your calendar. Just bring your bank statement in your calendar. That's where we're going to start the conversation. Those are your priorities. And it took me a while to go back to him because I knew exactly what he was going to see and I did not like the answer. And so I think if if you're saying friendships are important to you, then the question is how are you spending your time and how are you spending your money? And that doesn't mean you spend your money on your friends, but like are you spending your money on a social event or doing things with but but that's I mean your priorities are how you spend your resources. It's a good way to go to break. Let's go to break. When we come back, we're going to talk more about how you spend your time and how you balance these friendships with everything with all the other with all the five Fs in life. we're talking about friendship and over the decades and how they change from childhood through adult. Let's talk about the balance. John, before the break, you mentioned, "Show me your show me your checkbook. Show me your calendar." And I know it's important to you, right? And wow. I mean, the takeaway for me is really again a lot of I've just not had a strategy. I haven't really invested in the friends and so I know you as you have a family you spend less time on friends and and Anthony said it earlier you can't do everything. Yeah.

[07:06] So how do you balance it? How do you spend your time? I mean what I mean it's not going to look the same for all of us but what does that look like and how do you figure out what is right? I think this is a hard question. Really hard. when I and I've met some people that are so happy inside their like marriage as an example that they will without being pulled out of that little cocoon they would literally just spend all of their time together and you know talking about a mentor of mine who's you know late 70s and and so it's really deliberate for him to move out of that because he's so comfortable at home and candidly with my wife I mean I could spend all day every day with her and we we'd be you know peas is in a pod. We love love love hanging out with each other. And so we we talk about like who are the friends we want to have, not by name, but like how do we continue to make sure that we get outside of our cocoon um to nurture those relationships because it's important to both of us and it's good for our marriage and it's good for our community and you know so um I don't know Anthony I mean I can dive deeper into this but I know you've got some thoughts here too. You know, it just again I always think about the the the season you're in, you know, that that drives where your where your priorities are. So being older, having grandkids, so forth, you know, I'll I'll maintain I'll work to maintain the contact with the the top five, if you will, and try to have a personal social life to some extent, but the priorities are now have have shifted dramatically to family. you know, just just a focus on family and the little kids coming up and where my kids are in their careers and so on and so forth. There's just But you've talked about our group though. I mean, I mean, you've talked about how important that's been for you and how important I mean, right? That's what I'm saying. That's that's the personal social stuff and and and that's and that's enough for me. You know, a couple, you know, three or four rounds of golf a month, a couple of lunches in in the group. That's ju that just that in itself is that's a lot. I mean if it is a lot if you add up the hours of that you're talking about 2530 40 hours a month. I mean that's a that's a big investment. Yeah. So it doesn't leave a lot of time to you know call a high school buddy and shoot the shoot the breeze with them. You know what I mean?

[09:34] So I mean you got 12 or 15 people that you're right. Again I'm going to sound like a broken record. Thanks thanks for technology. Yeah, because you can just fire off a text and text Jimmy and find out if the house you finished the house, you know, those types of things. And that's enough. And that I think we maybe glossed over that a little bit. You don't have to go spend a weekend with somebody to show them that you care and to connect, you know. Um, it's a common misconception for men though that I think there's a there's a stereotype that is probably welld deserved that men like the large grandiose um display of thing where relationships are built day by day, moment by moment. It doesn't require a minute a day. It requires a minute occasionally depending on where the relationship is in its growth. Right? Newer relationships might need more care and feeding, but as relationships kind of get through the years, they may require less care and feeding. and just that moment of connection. And you know, one of my friends, Chris, like um has a hundred amazing traits, but one of those traits is that he just makes you feel awesome.

[10:41] Like when Chris opens his mouth, whoever he's around is going to feel awesome, you know? And so I may not get to see Chris because he doesn't live in the same town right now as often as I want. He used to live 100 feet away and that was amazing. And I truly miss that. But man, when Chris opens his mouth, even if I'm not the person he's talking about, I feel great, too. Like he just And so it doesn't take a lot. We need more Chris's. Oh, yeah. For sure. Let me tell you a little a story about the use of technology and how it was really impactful in terms of a relationship I had with someone who I had a lot of respect for. one of my first jobs um going all the way back into the 90s um I had a really good relationship with a peer and um hadn't spoken to him in a long time. You know, we we would cross paths every five or six years or whatever. So, Hurricane Harvey hit and the last time I had spoke to him, he was living in uh Texas. And so I, you know, as things settled down, I sent him a text and said, "Hey, just just checking in, making sure you and the family are okay." Well, about an hour later, the phone rings. And it's him. He goes, "That was the nicest freaking thing anyone has done. I am that I can't believe it came. It came from you." You know, kind of joking, right? And I go, "Okay." He says, "And the good news is I moved to South Carolina, so I'm doing fine." and you know I retired from that other job and so on and so forth. But he was so touched that after we hadn't talked on the phone in 20 years but he uh he picked up the phone and of course he had to make me feel like a you know whatever. But um it the point of the story is how impactful you can be with five or six words. Yeah. Doesn't take a lot. But but I think for me, you know, I have to be thoughtful and deliberate.

[12:37] And so I have to take stock of like, am I doing what I want? Like are the actions I'm taking leading to the outcomes that I want? And so if I want to be a net giver, like am I showing up in the way that I want to show up? And so um and then how can I do better? And so that's where I think about like like I just shot a text message off to Chris real quick and told him what you said. Like just right now I just took a couple seconds while we're talking shoot him a note. say, "Hey man, was just talking about how awesome you make me feel on a podcast and the guy said, "We need more Chris in the world." And true words couldn't be spoken. So, I wanted to give that back to immediately. And um it doesn't take more than a second or two. And so, but it but I do think it for for me, I I meet people who I perceive to be natural at this and I'm not natural at this. And so, I I want to work at it. and and I work I don't like that word because it makes it seem like more than it should or need to be, but I I want relationships. I I really value it and I um so I don't know. Boy, there there's a there's a lesson here for this episode's really got me thinking about a lot of things. Um you know, I'm just I'm thinking back to the love languages.

[13:46] When we talk about the five love languages, we think in our romantic thing a lot. Yeah. Gary Chapman is the guy with the love languages and he did talk about it in romantic but then he moved it out into other parts of the world too later on. But yeah and friends. So I I am for me a lot of it is about time spent right and quality time. But hearing you guys talk it it also makes it clear I'm not good about this just little quick things. And I think it's because that's not not that I dislike that your love language but that's not yeah that's not what moves me but that's not what's important. I need to think more about what what does that other person need? We typically give in our love language which can like be an oversight, right? And so giving to people in their love language is a big part of what his books are about is how do you give to people in their love language? And so we'll put a link to Gary Chapman's five love languages stuff in the show notes, but it's it's a really it's a cool series of books. So yeah, I think I think that's fantastic. Um, was were you saying physical touch? I saw you touch crap. No. Do you know your love language? I We've been through this before. I don't I'm not I don't buy any of it. Your love language is Boston.

[14:59] You know, it's it's what's in it's in the moment. you know, I'm much more reactive to what I'm presented with as opposed to, you know, trying to be um try to take advantage of what I think someone's love language is. But because it having been in a committed relationship for 50 plus years, I can tell you that the love language has changed. Yeah. and on a ride home. probably. So, um I just don't I just don't think there's more to that ride home we need to talk to Jan about, you know, not not to dismiss it. I just It's just not me. I don't I don't think that way. I'm I'm a much more reactive person, an in the- moment person. And but you might be one of the people, like I mentioned, that's just naturally better at at connecting with someone where they are and don't need the mental model. That that may be it. Who knows?

[16:03] Unconsciously competent. You're just better at this. Damn it. I mean, 50 years in a committed relationship, you're doing something right. Yeah. Yeah. Or where Jan is. Totally. Yeah. I totally agree with that. I mean, it's um but it we're talking about maintaining a friendship and maintaining a relationship and having the the fast five. Well, she's one of those, right? Of course. And so there was we both had have had to work at keeping it alive and keeping it going through all the seasons and all the different trials, tribulations, successes. Is there a story and I don't want to like you know marriage is a pretty sacred thing so I don't want to dive deep deep deep deep we want to make sure that Jan wants to listen to this episode without killing you so you can come back but is like can you give us a story that she would approve of about where it's taken some work for the friendship piece of it I don't know the answer myself so that's why I'm so putting on you I'll broaden it out a little bit you know I've had a long I've had a long career in multiple businesses in multiple cities yep and the transitions from one to the other put a tremendous strain on her. You know, it's it's um I wish I was a professional athlete who just signed a free agent contract for $800 million and had to move to a city. I liken those moves to something like that where that athlete is feeling great. You know, he's moved now to New York City. He's got $800 million Oh, wait a minute. He has two kids in elementary school, one in middle school, a wife that had a career in that other city. Her mother who's not feeling well is living in that city, but now she's moving to New York. You leave a lot a lot of flatsom in the wake when you're when you're going when you're transitioning like that. And I did that several times and some of the timing was really not good. And that put that put a lot of strain on her.

[18:07] And by the grace of whoever Jan the grace of Jan grace of Jan and the and the powers that be she solded through it um kept the family together. Part of that's commitment too, right? I think there's one level of commitment for a marriage. I I do think that there's a place where you can be committed to friendships. Maybe not at that marriage level, but there's a commitment to work through things. We talked about this a little bit last time that where Anthony and I had a little bit of sideways and but we were committed to that process because we'd been through it for, you know, two or three businesses before that and we, you know, we believed the best in each other. Like we we were able to give people the benefit or give each other the benefit of the doubt. And I think once you've had enough kind of time on the water with somebody, you can get to a commitment level where you're not just going to let um some rough water shake it up. And then there are some relationships where I've been in early on there was lots of rough water, lots of drama and it's like yeah the commitment's not just not there and that's okay and then it's just, you know, accepting that too. So I I mean Yeah. Yeah. And what Anthony said, I mean again I'm going to go back to the instigator or facilitator in this case.

[19:16] It sounds like Jan has been the the person really holding that together. And I, you know, I think about in my life, my mom before she passed is what kept me connected to that side of the family. Yeah. Like I I get along great with all those people and I hardly ever talk. Since my mom passed, that facilitator's gone and I haven't done the work to reach out. Yeah. They haven't done it. I haven't done it. And again, I just like out of sight, out of mind. The mo a lot of them live in Minnesota. I'm here, but my mom is not there to be the facilitator to bring everybody together. Well, being an instigator isn't hard, right? It's there's a little bit of vulnerability and you have to put yourself out there and you've got to be a little bit of an organizer, but it's not and I think in a in a perfect world, which it's not, everybody would take on the role of the instigator for a period and there'd be like a natural unspoken handoff of the baton, and that's not the reality in my experience. Um, but I think over time it gets easier and there's less instigation required and there's more commitment and and there's just more grace for times the periods in between. But early on, if I'm a listener in my late 20s, early 30s, like you may really have to lean in in some places um to to newer relationships. And then you might have, you know, relationships that started in high school that you don't have to lean in as much. But I think it's important like if I were talking to my son at you know in his late 30s he's not. He's in his early 20s. But if you're in his early 30s or late 20s I would tell him like make sure that you're investing in the new relationships going forward and being deliberate about growing your personal network. Not just your professional network but your personal networks too because those relationships like that's the thing on your deathbed that you think about is is from everything that I've read.

[21:00] Let's let's give listeners if listeners are anything like me, they're thinking about people that have drifted out of their lives, right? I I'm my mind is is like, you know, kind of what can I do to just reach out to this person a little bit. So, let's give them some John, you I I think what you did on the thing sending that text to Chris is I think that's amazing, right? That that's fantastic. What? So, what else can can a listener do to if they want to kind of revive or reach out to that drifting friendship, tell that person they're important? What would what would you suggest either of you? Well, the first thing I would suggest isn't so much um deciding on who. It's how much time do I want to devote to And if you're going to put an hour a week into it, 5 hours a week into it, uh from 12 to 12:30, two days a week, set the time aside and then it will come to you because you'll emotionally prioritize who or what you want to reconnect with. you know, um it could be um it doesn't have to be an individual, could be a group, it could be, you know, a hobby where um you used to go paint um or a gym you visited and that that social network while it isn't an individual s a specific individual, it's a group that you like being around. So, it's it's a decide on the amount of time and then emotionally I think it will come to you, you know, and this this is a kind of a cathartic moment these last 45 or 50 minutes in terms of self-reflecting on some things that that I know is going to drive me to go do something and and I was literally thinking, okay, how am I going to do it? And that's what came to mind is okay, I gota I got to decide on how much time I want to devote and then I know the important things will come to the surface and I'll devote the energy to that. I think that's really wise. I love the answer. I think but I think it can be simpler too. Like for people that might feel overwhelming, you can also just like do what I did, send a text.

[23:18] Yeah. Like don't make a list just as it comes to your mind. Spend 30 seconds and then you're just going to plant a lot of those seeds and and then some of those seeds are going to sprout and some of those seeds may not right now and whatever the case may be. But I think just I think so. Yes, everything Anthony said and if you need something simpler because that's too big a stretch right now. I'm just you know for some people that would be too big a commitment. Just do something and do make it small like doesn't have to be big. You know we talked in previous episodes about how social media has actually led to more isolation and and people feeling worse. But I think this is one of the benefits of it's like anything, right? There's the good and the bad. This is one of the places where you can reach out and I know it's lower risk too for sure. Yeah. When Facebook first came around, one of the things I enjoyed is, oh wow, I haven't talked to this person for 20 years and there it is. And you'd catch up and I kind of enjoyed that part of it, right? And it'd be overwhelming to reconnect with all those people, but it is it is still there for that with a lot of people assuming you're both on there. John, during the break, you talked about attachment. you want to go in a little more what you were thinking about there?

[24:26] Yeah. I mean, we were just talking about like attachment theory and you know, I think we're just recognizing there's different kinds of attachment. Secure attachment, super healthy, anxious and avoidant attachment, not so much. And and so this is really about accepting people where they are. And so I think as you get into relationships, you know, um there's a great book attached on the subject and it's um about romantic relationships and some of the ways you grew up and all that good stuff. But I think that um my encouragement to people is try to accept people right where they are. And maybe this is me projecting because sometimes I used to, you know, want people to be someone different than they were, but my best friendships are the people that accept me in all of my, you know, weaknesses and and and they can joke with me about them and vice versa. And we can and um yeah, and I just feel really accepted for where I am and I know they see me for where I am. And I know that despite all of the things that that are flaws, they they still want to hang out with me. They still want to connect. And it's the same on both both ways. And there's no judgment about that. And so I think that you know, so if um yeah, so it was we talked about attachment, but really it was about acceptance. It was it was the underlying like can you accept someone right where they are to develop that relationship and and that that leads to a lot of grace. Um, it's a great, you know, one of the four fun fundamental things we talked about as skill sets to develop last time.

[25:51] I think that I think that's a great lead into our our next episode. Part five is going to be just, you know, meeting people where they are is accepting them and dealing with some part five is going to be dealing with some of the tougher stuff and and navigating the conflict and going into that. But wow, this episode has been this is probably one of the more eyeopening episodes for me. I the the concept of the facilitator or somebody to take charge how important that is is something I hadn't really seems obvious but it hadn't I don't know just hadn't really thought about it and or instigator and also just again me thinking about who should I reach out to and you know what time like Anony's talking about what time should I invest in this and that you know some of these relationships that probably haven't maintained as which really does come back to me not investing the time and effort. And in fairness, the other person didn't either, but you know, I mean, again, we're busy with life. So, and sometimes there's all this like kind of false fear about like, oh my gosh, whatever, whatever. And you reach out and both people. So, yeah, there's a lot of lot of fruit at the end of that road.

[27:01] Next time crisis and conflict, we'll get into the kind of the how do you navigate the hard stuff. Yeah. So, listeners, uh, as always, thank you for listening. download, subscribe, tell your friends, tell your family, tell everybody. Uh, give us feedback. It's a gift. And, uh, check us out. There's tools, free tools on the website at talesofabundance.com. Thank you for listening and have a fantastic day.